is it worth dishing out $50 for a c64 for this? - erutufon|nofuture

content · 30th January 2006

http://www.prophet64.com/

and how does this whole din sync thing work? would it be hard to hook it up to midi?

antithesis · 30th January 2006

Personally i think it would be well worth getting hold of a c64 for this. I've already tried running it in a c64 emulator on windows and it sounds the business even on an emulated SID. The TR-Edition sounds sweet too.

As far as getting it to run with midi you would need to convert a midi clock to din-sync with something like a phillip rees box or a TR-707. I think you might need to solder a connection from your din-sync cable to one of the pins on the cartridge interface of the c64. It's all explained in the manual for prophet64.

Yer_Maw · 30th January 2006

wow. i always thought the c64 was to slow to impliment midi, hence why they never done it.

The sid is a real beast. Designed by synth people, not chip people.

content · 30th January 2006

how hard would it be to pull out the chip and make a synth with it?

**Loz** · 30th January 2006

I want to make one of these

http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid.html

Yer_Maw · 30th January 2006

from that link

"In difference to programs that are running on the C64 like the Triad MIDIslave, AnyWare M64 or the Prophet64, MIDIbox SID features more software implemented high-resolution modulation sources (LFOs, EGs), independent sound engines for all 3 voices and a low-latency MIDI interface (no note drops...) - these capabilities can only be realized with a CPU that runs much faster than the 6502."

**Loz** · 30th January 2006

ah fuck, shouldn't have looked up that page

I've now accidentally put a bid on two C64 machines on ebay

Futureman · 30th January 2006

Man..

I got hold of a C64 just for the above.

I was going to build a interface for the C64 to run the prophet 64 too.

It's just a few wires soldered onto a connector. Not rocket science.

I even had all these crazy ideas about putting the C64 + a tiny screen + the software (Get it burnt onto a cartridge for instant loading) all in one cool looking box and have a portable nasty c64 synth/sequencer.

I do like the idea of the Sid box too. make one then buy one of those cheap arse behringer control boxes and have a frigging SID station for less than half the price.
The custom controllers on that site seem to have a few difficult hurdles of overcome when making them.

**M H** · 31st January 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by content

how hard would it be to pull out the chip and make a synth with it?

http://www.sidstation.com/

Paddy · 31st January 2006

Â£800 ^

**r_v** · 1st February 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by niknak

Â£800 ^

aye, but it funded the development of your precious machinedrum, eh

anyone know how to tell which version of the SID chip is inside a C64? I'm told that earlier versions of the SID (or maybe the C64 itself) didn't implement the filters very well and I want to make sure I don't get one of them if I buy one off e-bay.

**Loz** · 1st February 2006

there's two versions of the SID that I'm aware of. Both were in the C64, so I guess later models will have the improved chip.

Paddy · 1st February 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by r_v

aye, but it funded the development of your precious machinedrum, eh

hehe true

1st February 2006

There is a SID emulator and a rebirth mod on the support page if you divn't want to fork out Â£800 and you can deal with software rather than the original chip

**Loz** · 1st February 2006

hardware > software

*can of worms: opened!*

*Spandex* · 1st February 2006

I loved my C64 for music... microrhythm.. ubik's music.. multisound synthesiser etc.. I even had the "sampler" cartridge for it. But jeez... why on earth anyone would CHOOSE to use it now is completely beyond me.

I still love that superfast arpeggio sound... but it was all about squeezing pretend polyphony out of a 3-voice chip... and you don't need a SID.. *any* sq wave arpeggio at that speed starts sounding like a SID. I don't want all my tracks to sound like the Ocean Loader

I could sit and listen to the "Crazy Comets" music all day tho.
http://gallium.prg.dtu.dk/HVSC/C64Mu...azy_Comets.sid

*Spandex* · 1st February 2006

Oh.. listened to the 8580 ... slightly diffrunt fish in that kettle. Still. Not sure it's worth all the trouble.

Yer_Maw · 1st February 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spandex

I loved my C64 for music... microrhythm.. ubik's music.. multisound synthesiser etc.. I even had the "sampler" cartridge for it. But jeez... why on earth anyone would CHOOSE to use it now is completely beyond me.

I still love that superfast arpeggio sound... but it was all about squeezing pretend polyphony out of a 3-voice chip... and you don't need a SID.. *any* sq wave arpeggio at that speed starts sounding like a SID. I don't want all my tracks to sound like the Ocean Loader

I could sit and listen to the "Crazy Comets" music all day tho.
http://gallium.prg.dtu.dk/HVSC/C64Mu...azy_Comets.sid

nah, i think the SID has a design worthy of being called a synth. Its not just a crappy sound generator, designed by people who knew synthesis.

*Spandex* · 1st February 2006

Oh yeah.. it has a synth design alright.. it's 3 monosynths on a chip basically... i just think they're 3 fairly average monosynths.. and all the stuff I love about it (and I do love it) comes from the people pushing it beyond its limits. For me it's a nostalgic sound tho.. and it's VERY distinctive. I'd be pissed off if I bought a record that had it on more than 1 track.

Having said all this.. listening to the 8580 for the first time.. it sounds a lot better..the filters on the 6581 were very weak.. more like a shelving EQ.. i didn't even realise they WERE filters until I read the spec tbh.. maybe there are very different model.. I had a pretty early C64. Still.. even with the 8580, for that amount of money/time I'd go for sommat else.

Yer_Maw · 1st February 2006

yeah it is destinctive, although much more, but so is a moog. i think it deserves a place in the grand scheme of things. Its not like its a Z80 hacked to be a sound chip, and it sounds pretty unique, (although you just said any square wave can sound like it make up your mind)

Therefore, its a brilliant chip.

*Spandex* · 1st February 2006

If you think I'm going to sit here and tolerate you having a different opinion on this chip then you've got another thing coming. I'm going to carry on until you agree with me.

Do you agree with me yet?

Yer_Maw · 1st February 2006

I stay defiant.

*Spandex* · 1st February 2006

Hehehe. Shit.

**Loz** · 8th February 2006

Well, I've bought an old C64 and the parts required to make the Midibox SID. I made the mistake of listening to the mp3s, it does sound really good. They've improved the filters, too, they sound proper now.

ckpqerjwrpwp · 8th February 2006

It's all about clever sequencing, cos otherwise it does just sound like a bad synth. Takes a lot of work to actually get something 'genuine' sounding like Spandex says.

**Loz** · 8th February 2006

listen to what is possible:

http://www.midibox.org/midibox_sid/mbsid_demo3.mp3

http://www.midibox.org/midibox_sid/mbsid_demo8.mp3

http://www.midibox.org/midibox_sid/A...SID_Remix).mp3

all SIDs and Logic effects.

*Spandex* · 8th February 2006

Um... yeh..

ckpqerjwrpwp · 8th February 2006

It's really not hard to make SID sounds on a micromod.

**Loz** · 8th February 2006

yeah, but I'm doing this only 40% for the sounds. 60% of the reason is because it looks like a fun project to do.

big raff · 23rd March 2007

i plan on buying prophet64 next week

30th January 2006	#1
content Why do people Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: spasticville Posts: 1,458	is it worth dishing out $50 for a c64 for this? http://www.prophet64.com/ and how does this whole din sync thing work? would it be hard to hook it up to midi?
	:: quote post ::

30th January 2006	#2
antithesis Registered Erutufon Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Hamilton Posts: 147	Personally i think it would be well worth getting hold of a c64 for this. I've already tried running it in a c64 emulator on windows and it sounds the business even on an emulated SID. The TR-Edition sounds sweet too. As far as getting it to run with midi you would need to convert a midi clock to din-sync with something like a phillip rees box or a TR-707. I think you might need to solder a connection from your din-sync cable to one of the pins on the cartridge interface of the c64. It's all explained in the manual for prophet64.
	:: quote post ::

30th January 2006	#3
Yer_Maw cos we dont fuck about Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: chansville Posts: 5,901	wow. i always thought the c64 was to slow to impliment midi, hence why they never done it. The sid is a real beast. Designed by synth people, not chip people.
	:: quote post ::

30th January 2006	#4
content Why do people Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: spasticville Posts: 1,458	how hard would it be to pull out the chip and make a synth with it?
	:: quote post ::

30th January 2006	#5
Loz ......................... Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 7,630	I want to make one of these http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_sid.html ........................... "If you can't tell what genre the track you're making is you should have your instruments taken away and made to stand in the corner."
	:: quote post ::

30th January 2006	#8
Futureman Living in the past Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 185	Man.. I got hold of a C64 just for the above. I was going to build a interface for the C64 to run the prophet 64 too. It's just a few wires soldered onto a connector. Not rocket science. I even had all these crazy ideas about putting the C64 + a tiny screen + the software (Get it burnt onto a cartridge for instant loading) all in one cool looking box and have a portable nasty c64 synth/sequencer. I do like the idea of the Sid box too. make one then buy one of those cheap arse behringer control boxes and have a frigging SID station for less than half the price. The custom controllers on that site seem to have a few difficult hurdles of overcome when making them.
	:: quote post ::

31st January 2006	#10
Paddy <<<<:>>>> Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Dùn Èideann Posts: 9,577	Â£800 ^
	:: quote post ::

1st February 2006	#12
Loz ......................... Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 7,630	there's two versions of the SID that I'm aware of. Both were in the C64, so I guess later models will have the improved chip. ........................... "If you can't tell what genre the track you're making is you should have your instruments taken away and made to stand in the corner."
	:: quote post ::

1st February 2006	#14
JonnySpeed Posts: n/a	There is a SID emulator and a rebirth mod on the support page if you divn't want to fork out Â£800 and you can deal with software rather than the original chip
	:: quote post ::

1st February 2006	#16
Spandex Very Bad Dog Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Nottingham Posts: 8,428	I loved my C64 for music... microrhythm.. ubik's music.. multisound synthesiser etc.. I even had the "sampler" cartridge for it. But jeez... why on earth anyone would CHOOSE to use it now is completely beyond me. I still love that superfast arpeggio sound... but it was all about squeezing pretend polyphony out of a 3-voice chip... and you don't need a SID.. any sq wave arpeggio at that speed starts sounding like a SID. I don't want all my tracks to sound like the Ocean Loader I could sit and listen to the "Crazy Comets" music all day tho. http://gallium.prg.dtu.dk/HVSC/C64Mu...azy_Comets.sid ........................... lovely cloakroom. lovely cloaks - barbam nondum video
	:: quote post ::

1st February 2006	#23
Spandex Very Bad Dog Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Nottingham Posts: 8,428	Hehehe. Shit. ........................... lovely cloakroom. lovely cloaks - barbam nondum video
	:: quote post ::

8th February 2006	#24
Loz ......................... Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 7,630	Well, I've bought an old C64 and the parts required to make the Midibox SID. I made the mistake of listening to the mp3s, it does sound really good. They've improved the filters, too, they sound proper now. ........................... "If you can't tell what genre the track you're making is you should have your instruments taken away and made to stand in the corner."
	:: quote post ::

8th February 2006	#25
ckpqerjwrpwp SELL OUT Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 6,416	It's all about clever sequencing, cos otherwise it does just sound like a bad synth. Takes a lot of work to actually get something 'genuine' sounding like Spandex says.
	:: quote post ::

8th February 2006	#27
Spandex Very Bad Dog Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Nottingham Posts: 8,428	Um... yeh.. ........................... lovely cloakroom. lovely cloaks - barbam nondum video
	:: quote post ::

23rd March 2007	#30
big raff get lost Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: troqueer Posts: 1,535	i plan on buying prophet64 next week
	:: quote post ::

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