football...

[cynthia]

check out the maniacs...

http://www.gepflegt-arrogant.com/fwwfront.html

[jukka]

stupi idiots, but at least they just fought each other (and no one who isn't up for that shit like its happing in stadiums) !

[Paddy]

whoa, fuck that!

[darny.m]

the yobs wear burberry caps on the continent too.

nothing like a friendly kick about on a saturday afternoon.

[emef]

crikey, what a bunch of losers.

[FiST]

can any of the germans on da board maybe translate this text that goes with it.....

F/W/W Hardturm Front Zürich gegen Bande Basel ( unter 30 Jahren )

Vorgeschichte:
Anlässlich der Begegnung Grasshoppers - Basel im Winter 2003 handelte die Hardturm Front für diesen Tag einen Waffenstillstand aus. Sie wollten der Blamage des "aus dem Stadion Schleichens" entgehen. Als Gegenleistung boten sie uns ein 30:30 auf dem Feld an. Nachträglich setzten sie das Alterslimit auf 30 Jahre fest. Die Bande Basel willigte ein. Beide Firms setzten nur Leute ein,die sich auch jeweils beim Fussball gegenüber stehen.


it kinda looks like they are doing this like it is some kind of sport or something? idiots.

[jukka]

i would like to, but i am afraid my translation would't be proper.
so its maybe better if you wait for someone who can do it better than me
:D

[FiST]

jukka just a rough translation would be great, just curious as to wtf is going on there, apart from the obvious fighting.

[jukka]

okay here it is.......

hardturm front against zürich gang basel (under the age of 30)
in case of the match basel against zürich in winter 2003 hardturm front made a deal with gang basel about a armistice in the stadium (because they don't wanted to blame themself by creeping out of the stadium).
in return they offered them a fight 30 against 30 on a field (just persons up to 30 years not older).
ganga basel took the offer.
both firms just took people who usually fight during the football matches.

[FiST]

mentalists!

cheers jukka ;)

[Rick]

cant see the downside with boys like this in arranged fights, no room for a agression in todays society. Theyre doing something about theirs..I feel like punshing people in the face every day!

[dSort]

it`s normal...

[huey]

this has nothing to do with football.

[V Knid esq]

Well it sort of does. There's a really interesting interview with music and sports journo Danny Kelly about the history of hooligans in the Re:Search 'Pranks' book. He traces it back to the change in the UK football rules in the late 50s which allowed players to be payed as much as the clubs wanted. This led to the culture of buying/transferring the best players, and meant that the teams were no longer that representative of the town/area they came from. This in turn led to the fans looking for another way of expressing their fierce sense of loyalty, hence the formation of 'firms'.

Hooligan culture is a very interesting and ambiguous phenomenon, tied in with all kinds of subcultures - mod, skinhead, gangsterism etc - and the music scene, and it certainly isn't enough just to call all blokes who like a row at the football 'stupid thugs'. I'm supposed to be working right now, but I'll put down more thoughts later on.

[wheezer]

looking at how that text on the page is stylized, I'd say that it's clear that it has a lot, if not everything to do with football.

The terminology they use is scary, they refer to the 30:30 match as though it is a staple for resolving conflicts in this field, nice touch also on the opposing team having rung in later on, requiring that all be a maximum of 30 years old...

[huey]

yes, its interesting to read about mods, skins etc.

but violence has nothing to do with football. the guys that do a 30 vs 30 fight on a field, ok, but the same people do violent things in the town and in the stadium. It´s only a phenomenon for people who wants to analyze and to create (pseudo-)intellectual discussions.

violence is stupid and hooliganism is also stupid like war stupid is.

[V Knid esq]

I really disagree actually Huey - you don't have to think something is good to find it interesting... and I think to simply dismiss it as 'stupid' is exactly the attitude that allows the sick culture to continue. I know a few people who are or have been involved in football violence, and I would categorise none of them as 'stupid'... indeed one of them is a very very smart multi-millionaire, very talented musician and successful businessman. Anyway, I'm still working - I'll try and justify what I'm saying here a bit more later.

[amble]

i saw this documentary once, bbc i think, were they went on about hooliganism. and as you say knid, its a very interesting culture. the guys used to get dressed up pretty (uniformed but in a good way), and they had rules too (i cant really remember which). they made out a date somewhere and let it rumble. and i mean why not, everyone has to get rid off his agression in a way, and if they do it like that and dont pull in 'innocent' its ok i think.

now of course that has nothing to do with the sport itself, its a subculture related to football.

over here though, 'hooligans' are just poor little fucks only getting at someone when they know he has no chance, i.e. they are in a group. the revolutions is eating itself.

[huey]

"I really disagree actually Huey - you don't have to think something is good to find it interesting... "

@ v knid
I never say that something have to be good to be interesting. the only thing I say is that football has nothing to do with violence. that all.