Neuromancer

[Loz]

Just finished reading this at the weekend. For some reason, I'd never read it before. A lot of homages are now making a lot of sense. Took me ages to think why I seemed to remember the name Wintermute. Turns out it was the name of the main fileserver at my old school!

The question is, are Gibson's other books worth a read? I really enjoyed Neuromancer, but I'm unsure if that's his only 'classic' or if he's a persistantly great writer, like say Dick, rather than a one-hit wonder. Opinions greatly welcome.

Also, as a sideline, I was with my sister and her boyfriend at the weekend, and her boyfriend, seeing I was reading the book, asked "Is it good? My mate Chris is doing a film based on that." Took me a couple of seconds to register, because he said it so casually, as if he didn't really understand who Chris Cunningham is, nor how anticipated the Neuromancer film exactly is.

[phil]

his mate Chris!! muhahah

hes talking shit. Chris ain't making Neuromancer anymore. If he was such a mate he'd have known "chris" is working on Rankzerox and Tom jenkinson is doing the soundtrack. suka

[penciLneck]

ok, phil - just coz you know him...

In answer to :

The question is, are Gibson's other books worth a read? I really enjoyed Neuromancer, but I'm unsure if that's his only 'classic' or if he's a persistantly great writer, like say Dick, rather than a one-hit wonder. Opinions greatly welcome.

I liked them all, especially 'virtual light' and 'idoru' and 'mona lisa overdrive' - things did seem to weaken a little in 'all tomorrows parties' tho. but hey he's been churning em out for a while now. Go fer it - read em all!

[phil]

im not mates with chris, but im mates with tom. he says Ranxzerox going to be very violant its based on the comic. toms says hes not really up for the whole violance thing which is fair enough. he would do "Frank" by jim woodring no doubt.

[Loz]

As far as I know, Chris and Billy Gibson are still working on Neuromancer, just very, very slowly. Whether or not this project will ever be completed, I do not know.

[penciLneck]

Billy Gibson has also made a bit of a strange road trip movie:

http://www.nomaps.com/

[JE:5]

I picked up Virtual Light a charity shop a few months back, quite good.
I didn't like Count Zero much though.

[decadnids]

neuromancer is a good read - if you like that then read
shock wave rider by john brunner (done in 75 I think)
wt quicks a dream of flesh and sand

[JE:5]

I'm pretty sure Neuromancer is where the makers of the Matrix got a few ideas from..and Lawnmower man...I mean, I could go on......

[Loz]

well, Neuromancer even called cyberspace 'the matrix'.

But yeah, it's the father of all modern cyberpunk stories. I just liked the Rasta tug pilot, Maelcum. Why hasn't he been put into more sci fi stories?

[decadnids]

the matrix - all you need to do is look at anything by philip k dick, or any other good sci-fi - the whole notion of the matrix is good but nothing new really, read one flew over the cookoo's nest, the indian, always talked about the "combine" the machinary under reality, that he could see after electro-shock therapy, it was all the workings and wiring under the boards so to speak - much like the matrix.

[Loz]

I remember reading an essay that said that the Matrix was just like the Force in Star Wars. This guy went into great detail at how George Lucas had started it all, since the Force was all around us, controlled everything, and could be manipulated for superhuman strength.

He talked about it as if the Force was real, too. He was a nutbar.

Needless it say, The Matrix is a lot of ideas from various different parts, different sci fi books, films, even religion. But it's mainly just a good action film. With kung fu. And Hugo Weaving.

Anyway, back to the matter at hand.. Gibson's books from around the same time as Neuromancer are worth getting?

[decadnids]

yeah get count zero and mona lisa overdrive both good gibson books. didnt like virtual light tho.

[penciLneck]

why not? I thought it was groovy.

[decadnids]

thought virtual light was a bit lame when I read it, also it didnt have the gritti-ness of his earlier stuff, was like he was writing for an audience that he knew, rather than just writing a good book, like neurmancer. if you see what I mean.

[decadnids]

on the topic of this stuff
Vurt - by jeff noon is a good read, also the others in the series, pollen, automated alice, nymphomation etc.

[penciLneck]

Yer I loved vurt/pollen/nymphomation - excellent books.

[phil]

get "frank" by jim woodring. thats endearing.

[decadnids]

yes "frank" is brilliant.

[phil]

have u seen trosper by woodring? i love it.

[wheezer]

idoru is prolly my fave gibson book as well, though I must admit that it's been quite a while since I read neuromancer.

lucas didn't originate anything with star wars except merchandising on fucking huge scale...

[decadnids]

wheezer - good point about lucas.

[phil]

lucas invented chewbacca u smack hed

[decadnids]

phil - good point.

[Magnumforce]

there is a new Gibson book just out
"pattern recognition" i think it is called.. dont know what it is like.
Neuromancer is amazing, have it as Pdf if anyone wants too read it

[Annefrankingmachine]

i would really like that pdf file magnum force.
if you got a minute please could you send it to annefrankingmachine@hotmail.co m?

(it would stop me writing irrelevent rubbish on here for a while aswell)

[amble]

yeah or could you post it on the ftp? i have to read that finally.

[grobelaar]

I like Neuromancer, took me a few years before I finally formed a theory about what he's saying in the book, because he never overtly says it - in fact I'm not even sure if he is saying this, but I have concocted a theory...

The book is about the emancipation of an AI... then you get the weird mystical alien thing at the end... which just seems like the weird mystical bit. The question for me is that if we could create a self aware network - what would it be aware of... us, the Earth and our society? Well certainly it would get the raw information from that... but what sort of perception would it form that's the important bit.

I mean, we're not aware of what out red blood cells are doing in our bodies? No.

So maybe it'll have some meta awareness of the larger universe. For it, maybe the Solar system is like a town... and the rest of the galaxy something to go and explore.

So that's what I thought Neuromancer was about, or at least what Gibson was saying at the end. But maybe I've construed that bit myself and made it up from my own theories and philosophy on ai, perceptions.

I liked the other books in the series, but I've never been that overly keen on Gibson, he seems to lose focus of his concepts...

Jeff Noon, Neal Stephenson are deffo my faves - Diamond Age blew me away - and Jeff Noon writes fantastic fairy tales, in a very modern sense...

[dirtyho]

I'm reading pattern recognition at the mo - seems really good. Less "sci-fi" than his other stuff but still very "futurist". I really like the trilogy Neuromancer, Count Zero, Mona Lisa. Liked Idoru - Virtual Light is the weakest for me and ATP. Jeff Noon - Wicked. Diamond Age - probably my fave contemporary sci-fi title (but you'll never beat K Dick I'm afraid)

[V Knid esq]

Pattern Recognition is very good, though the ending is a little lame - that's the problem with Gibson, he tries to make his plots tie up too neatly... doesn't really matter though, cos it's the detail and madness that keeps you reading.

Check out also Tea From An Empty Cup by Pat Cadigan - of especial interest to on-line gamers (i'm not one), but a great read to anyone.

[wheezer]

man perhaps its time for me to read some scifi this summer again, lots of book suggestions here I should check out...

[Loz]

Just finished American Psycho last night, actually. Great book. Had a hard time putting it down.

[penciLneck]

@grobs

Jeff Noon, Neal Stephenson are deffo my faves - Diamond Age blew me away - and Jeff Noon writes fantastic fairy tales, in a very modern sense...

I really like Stephenson, have read 'the big u' 'snow crash' and 'cryptonomicon' all of which are very different but extremely good. To G. and other neuromancer fans ( btw started reading 'shockwave rider') 'snowcrash' is another fantastic ghost in the machine early cyberspace bit 'o sci-fi lovelyness. Highly recommended!

[wheezer]

I think I have to reread snow crash in english, got it as a german translation as a present a few years ago and was less than impressed by the wording...

[antipolis]

Mona Lisa Overdrive is my favourit William Gibson book -along with Neuromancer of course.

[Ava]

iain m banks -feersum endjinn is a good take on the whole 'matrix/cyberspace/force' theme. he calls it 'the crypt'

in fact i would recommend any of his sci-fi stuff

[fly]

Gibson is good but I prefer Robert Anton Wilson and Phil Dick.

And Tom Robbins! Tom Robbins!

Know he's not Sci Fi but his ideas are as forward thinking as Philip K Dick's. Just finished his new-ish one, "Fierce Invalids Home From Hot Climates" (he always has these snappy titles - always forget them in bookshops)- it's fucking brilliant, read it or read Jitterbug Perfume or something if you've not come across him before.

The man is a lunatic genius of the best kind.

[baba]

loz- American Psycho - I remember reading that on the tube when I lived in London years and years ago. it got right inside my head and i remember feeling really wierd about reading it and enjoying it then feeling ashamed about enjoying it then enjoying the shame of enjoying it. ick.
anyway, I'm reading Zeros and Ones by Sadie Plant - meant to do it ages ago - finally got round. Good and paceyand renewed my enthusiasm for knitting (virtual and actual)- click click click