2012 - how awesome does this film look?

[Orang Utan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3Wucar1vxQ

[troymoyonionz]

farily awesome....
not as awesome if the prophecy's were actually true and it really was the end.

o well..

[olv]

yeh i think it looks ace, the road looks pretty epic too

http://www.apple.com/trailers/weinstein/theroad/

[bitconductor]

they shot it on Genesis.
i don't want to know exactly what that means.

[wheezer]

Where's Will Smith in comic relief mode, and I didn't see too many American flags in that trailer, wtf?

[troymoyonionz]

the road looks good... bit twisted.
but 2012 looks like it will leave me frustrated and unsatisfied.
like squeezy cheese.

ill still get baked on skunk and go and see it though.
same with the cheese.

[Loz]

big fat meh from me

I dunno, massive apocalyptic cgi just leaves me fairly cold. Sure, seeing the White House be blown up by a massive UFO in 1996 was pretty awesome, but really nothing since then. I can tell from the trailer "look! cgi! more cgi! ooh! more cgi!" that the story is going to be pretty shit. Give me a film that makes me think (Moon looks interesting, for example) over this kind of 'Blockbuster' toss any day.

[Loz]

Just seen the trailer for The Road, which looks better, but I'm not holding too many hopes for that one, either.

[penciLneck]

It looks pretty weak, but.. at least it's got John Cusack in it. NOT Nicolas Cage.

I fucking hate Nicolas Cage.

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[Loz]

John Cusack seems to be turning slowly into Kevin Spacey from that trailer, too.

[thembuzz]

big fat meh from me

I dunno, massive apocalyptic cgi just leaves me fairly cold. Sure, seeing the White House be blown up by a massive UFO in 1996 was pretty awesome, but really nothing since then. I can tell from the trailer "look! cgi! more cgi! ooh! more cgi!" that the story is going to be pretty shit. Give me a film that makes me think (Moon looks interesting, for example) over this kind of 'Blockbuster' toss any day.

well, duh

that's like saying, "i'd choose les fleurs du mal over a copy of razzle". yeah, of course you would. but sometimes you just want a wank

[Loz]

I don't think I'd ever want to watch that film, though. CGI always looks fake, anyway, and just isn't impressive anymore.

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

i find it all really hard to concentrate on.. it all just sort of slips over you I find. It doesn't make your imagination work in any way, it's all just laid out for you on a plate and it's boring.

[The Physicist]

thats the best bits right there in that trailer as with any blockbuster

[The Physicist]

and how can anyone complain about the CGI? i love seeing shtuff getting blown up and demolished. It's the rest of that pish that bores me.

[thembuzz]

hold on. let me write this down

big action blockbusters are a bit unedifying

fuck

i never realised. this changes everything

[Loz]

and how can anyone complain about the CGI? i love seeing shtuff getting blown up and demolished. It's the rest of that pish that bores me.

it looks like a computer game, it just doesn't look real

sure, model pyrotechnics didn't always look real, either, but they were real enough to make your imagination fill in the rest. Perhaps CGI occupies some sort of 'uncanny valley'

[Loz]

hold on. let me write this down

big action blockbusters are a bit unedifying

fuck

i never realised. this changes everything


it's down to taste, innit?

some people (like you) love watching a film which has big explosions and no plot, and some people (like me) are bored by that.

however, I love films with shit jokes in them (like Airplane), and other people just can't see what the appeal is of them.

horses for courses

[The Physicist]

i thought the cgi in that looked ok. although some films it does look pretty dodgy

[thembuzz]

it's down to taste, innit?

some people (like you) love watching a film which has big explosions and no plot, and some people (like me) are bored by that.

however, I love films with shit jokes in them (like Airplane), and other people just can't see what the appeal is of them.

horses for courses

yep. that's me. always with the explosions. i just can't get enough explosions

you cheeky cunt

[Orang Utan]

if you don't like seeing the world ending spectacularly on a big screen with lots of exploding world heritage sites, then you're a cunt. it's that simple.

[Loz]

if you don't like seeing the world ending spectacularly on a big screen with lots of exploding world heritage sites, then you're a cunt. it's that simple.

I loved it in 1996.

[thembuzz]

i loved 909s and 303s in 1996

[Loz]

I didn't. I was into guitars.

[Orang Utan]

I loved it in 1996.

what went wrong?

[Loz]

my 15th birthday?

[thembuzz]

don't worry, you'll stop taking everything so seriously once you've come out of adolescence

[Orang Utan]

yes, then it's explosions, kittens, double entendres and swearing lots once again.

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

I just can't concentrate on those really long CGI sequences, it all goes wrong for me at the point I notice it's CGI... these days the only way you can really tell that is when it's kinda obvious... like a city falling into the sea.. or when it looks too expensive to be real.

there is loads of really good CGI that you never notice though, in pretty much every single film that comes out of hollywood.

once CGI gets below a certain cost films like 2012 will just become B-movies that any tom dick and harry can make and the directors who want to make films with celebs in will have to start working out how to make things interesting again.

[Orang Utan]

i know what you mean - transformers confused the shit out of me - i still enjoyed it and if i ever do an ma in film studies, it will be michael bay and the art of pure cinema

[thembuzz]

i heard that actors are just pretending

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

yeah I almost mentioned transformers

my eyes just stop moving, I start to lose focus.. that's not very cinematic :)

[Orang Utan]

i also couldn't tell who was the bad robot and who was the good robot - all the names confused me and they all looked the same once they'd transformed.
that's one thing that annoys me about films - people's names aren't mentioned enough, so you never remember who's who, esp if it's a loud action film. they should wear name badges.

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

http://wwwdelivery.superstock.com/WI/223/1439/PreviewComp/SuperStock_1439R-93050.jpg

What did you say your name was? Maximus Grime?

[Orang Utan]

lol you got me

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

you're right though, it was confusing shite, didn't even work at the gratifying base level it should have done cos it was impossible to tell who the fucking baddie was.

[darrell]

Hope its got a good love story, and would be kool if it has a will smith rap track to go with it.

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

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[Patrick]

never bodes well for a film seeing :

From the director of

INDEPENDENCE DAY

and

THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW

[Patrick]

Anyway, I'd probably just end up worrying what was happening to all his records if I tried to watch that.

[Orang Utan]

never bodes well for a film seeing :

From the director of

INDEPENDENCE DAY

and

THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW
both awesome films.

[Patrick]

No way. I actually shouted "fuck off" at the screen when i saw Independence Day, and then remembered I'd gone to the cinema with my mum cos she really wanted to see it when she was over visiting me one time. She was well impressed. "Oh isn't that feckin marvellous language you've learned for yerself in england ?"

[Patrick]

I haven't seen the other one, but I won't let a minor detail like that stand in the way of me saying it's shit anyway. :)

[bigus]

yeh i think it looks ace, the road looks pretty epic too

http://www.apple.com/trailers/weinstein/theroad/

just finished reading "The Road" the other day. DOPE

[bigus]

never bodes well for a film seeing :

From the director of

INDEPENDENCE DAY

and

THE DAY AFTER TOMORROW

absolutely. That trailer looks shite to be honest

[thembuzz]

if there's one thing more depressing than people devouring popular entertainment dumbly and unquestioningly, it's people bitching about mainstream entertainment being a bit empty as if they've got some kind of unique insight, like, "can't you see, you fools! the elephant is big! big!"

yes, hollywood blockbusters are all just cgi. they're all action and no plot. they don't try to entrance you with wild flights of the imagination, they just want to amuse you for a couple of hours with explosions and hugeness. that's the point. THEY'RE PORN

[Orang Utan]

No way. I actually shouted "fuck off" at the screen when i saw Independence Day, and then remembered I'd gone to the cinema with my mum cos she really wanted to see it when she was over visiting me one time. She was well impressed. "Oh isn't that feckin marvellous language you've learned for yerself in england ?"

Independence Day is one of the greatest popcorn movies ever made - pure cinema
I can't believe you like Star Wars but think an Emmerich or Bay movie is shit. They learned their craft from Lucas.

[Patrick]

I can't believe you like Jeff Mills but don't like Umek.

[Orang Utan]

I haven't seen the other one, but I won't let a minor detail like that stand in the way of me saying it's shit anyway. :)
The Day After Tomorrow is great - it makes absolutely NO SENSE whatsoever yet it is absurdly entertaining.

[Orang Utan]

I can't believe you like Jeff Mills but don't like Umek.
umek isn't better than mills, but bay and emmerich are better than lucas.

[Patrick]

Ok, if I watch it and don't like it, you owe me 90 minutes of life.

[Orang Utan]

deal, if you don't like it, i'll entertain you for 90 minutes next time you're in london, so you won't feel like you've wasted your time entirely.

[phil2]

I just can't concentrate on those really long CGI sequences, it all goes wrong for me at the point I notice it's CGI... these days the only way you can really tell that is when it's kinda obvious... like a city falling into the sea.. or when it looks too expensive to be real.

there is loads of really good CGI that you never notice though, in pretty much every single film that comes out of hollywood.

once CGI gets below a certain cost films like 2012 will just become B-movies that any tom dick and harry can make and the directors who want to make films with celebs in will have to start working out how to make things interesting again.


Yeah - Let's take for example Robocop. In 1987 was a big blockbuster for it's time. Why is that film so enduring? Well on top of the wicked script, performances and direction by Verhoven it;s the effects work. The ED-209 sequence was laboriously stop-frame animated by Phil Tippet, who also animated the AT-TAT walkers. Hours upon hours went into stop motioning Ed-209 and the subsequent composite into real footage, and what is the result? A timeless sequence with an amazing vibe. to mockup a rig in 3d would take ten minutes and to animate it another ten with infinite undo potentials and tweaks to motion curves etc.. It all would have been over egged, motion blurred and horribly jarring. Stop motion is a dying art. Secondly, Prosthetic work. no cgi blood hits, no cgi facial appliances, proper latex/silicone prosthetics IN CAMERA. No Digital enviroments. nowadays, its so easy to digitally extend a set..In the old days they used Matte paintings. A great example is the end shot in Die Hard 2.. Its a big pullback from a runway full of planes, the shot would have been mega bucks to shoot and impossible, so they hired a man to paint a 12 foot runway with all the planes, emergency vehicles on, with black areas for the other footage to be projected on...It's a 12 second shot, Maybe in this instance using CGI is acceptable, but still MATTE paintings are a dying art and beautiful, check the painting at the start of the thing for the spaceship in the ice.

Another Verhoven film Total Recall, again has zero CGI..and amazing timeless moments, such as the Rob Bottin head splitting sequence, the amazing prosthetic makeup for the aliens and Quado. Non cgi blood squibs, the mars model work, Jonny cab etc.. all in camera, no digital set extensions and the like. Another point worth bearing in mind is nowadays its so easy to create a virtual camera, one that's capable of doing things no normal 35mm camera could possibly attempt. Combine this with the need to GRADE everything, and by that create this look for everyshot..think the matrix with its green hue for every scene etc..now cast your mind back to Robocop...sure it had a 'look' but there wasn't this color corrected conformity thats now applied to everyshot to make the film 'hang together'...back in the day, film was shot and cut together, not run through this color correction process (at least not to the extent that new films are today) at least... That was a disclaimer as color correcting has been done for years... Anyway, people know what i mean..

[Patrick]

deal, if you don't like it, i'll entertain you for 90 minutes next time you're in london, so you won't feel like you've wasted your time entirely.

You may as well start cutting peep holes in your Pringle sweater now, cos you're gonna be dancing for me.

[Orang Utan]

Yeah - Let's take for example Robocop. In 1987 was a big blockbuster for it's time. Why is that film so enduring? Well on top of the wicked script, performances and direction by Verhoven it;s the effects work. The ED-209 sequence was laboriously stop-frame animated by Phil Tippet, who also animated the AT-TAT walkers. Hours upon hours went into stop motioning Ed-209 and the subsequent composite into real footage, and what is the result? A timeless sequence with an amazing vibe. to mockup a rig in 3d would take ten minutes and to animate it another ten with infinite undo potentials and tweaks to motion curves etc.. It all would have been over egged, motion blurred and horribly jarring. Stop motion is a dying art. Secondly, Prosthetic work. no cgi blood hits, no cgi facial appliances, proper latex/silicone prosthetics IN CAMERA. No Digital enviroments. nowadays, its so easy to digitally extend a set..In the old days they used Matte paintings. A great example is the end shot in Die Hard 2.. Its a big pullback from a runway full of planes, the shot would have been mega bucks to shoot and impossible, so they hired a man to paint a 12 foot runway with all the planes, emergency vehicles on, with black areas for the other footage to be projected on...It's a 12 second shot, Maybe in this instance using CGI is acceptable, but still MATTE paintings are a dying art and beautiful, check the painting at the start of the thing for the spaceship in the ice.

Another Verhoven film Total Recall, again has zero CGI..and amazing timeless moments, such as the Rob Bottin head splitting sequence, the amazing prosthetic makeup for the aliens and Quado. Non cgi blood squibs, the mars model work, Jonny cab etc.. all in camera, no digital set extensions and the like. Another point worth bearing in mind is nowadays its so easy to create a virtual camera, one that's capable of doing things no normal 35mm camera could possibly attempt. Combine this with the need to GRADE everything, and by that create this look for everyshot..think the matrix with its green hue for every scene etc..now cast your mind back to Robocop...sure it had a 'look' but there wasn't this color corrected conformity thats now applied to everyshot to make the film 'hang together'...back in the day, film was shot and cut together, not run through this color correction process (at least not to the extent that new films are today) at least... That was a disclaimer as color correcting has been done for years... Anyway, people know what i mean..
wow - a serious post from phil - spot on as well

[thembuzz]

isn't there an argument, in this day and age, for making films with as little material waste as possible?

[adsr]

No way. I actually shouted "fuck off" at the screen when i saw Independence Day, and then remembered I'd gone to the cinema with my mum cos she really wanted to see it when she was over visiting me one time. She was well impressed. "Oh isn't that feckin marvellous language you've learned for yerself in england ?"

:D

[Orang Utan]

isn't there an argument, in this day and age, for making films with as little material waste as possible?
seems rather a disingenuous one to me

[adsr]

I'm looking forward to transformers 2 tomorrow..
I enjoyed Terminator salvation(even with Cristian Bale in it...I'm getting a bit tired of his face...lol...)as well as Wolverine Origins...

that 2012 however, looks like shit tho...
still haven't seen independence day nor day after tomorrow....
and the GI Joe movie looks to be abit crap as well...haven't totally decided tho...and I've been pretty pissed off about s.Darko movie that's come out(since Donnie Darko is one of my favorite movies - on my top 5 list)..
I think that looks even more shit than 2012...

[thembuzz]

seems rather a disingenuous one to me

well, it seems perfectly valid to me

[Orang Utan]

only if you believe in it and you ventured the argument as gingerly as reggie perrin would if he were asking cj for a rise

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

well, it seems perfectly valid to me

its a little far fetched to think a render farm requires no material waste, it's mainlining the gas, oil and coal.

[Sheridan]

lol

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090623/REVIEWS/906239997

[V Knid esq]

wow - a serious post from phil - spot on as well

It is! More of this sort of thing!!

[V Knid esq]

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You're just jealous because you will never PARTY THAT HARD as long as you live.

[Loz]

Combine this with the need to GRADE everything, and by that create this look for everyshot..think the matrix with its green hue for every scene etc..now cast your mind back to Robocop...sure it had a 'look' but there wasn't this color corrected conformity thats now applied to everyshot to make the film 'hang together'...back in the day, film was shot and cut together, not run through this color correction process (at least not to the extent that new films are today) at least... That was a disclaimer as color correcting has been done for years... Anyway, people know what i mean..

That's something that really annoys me about modern films. Especially science fiction ones. The most recent Terminator 4 film would have been shit even without the washed out and grey/brown grading, but it just made it worse.

[V Knid esq]

Oh yeah talking of old vs new special effects, they're remaking Clash Of The Titans :( :( :(

[phil2]

Re: clash...Ray Harryhausen, yeah, i can't believe they are remaking that. That film was the work of one man. I've got so much respect for Ray, the scene in Jason and the Argonauts with the skeletons took something like 6 months to complete..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yYeZMx1Y7U

Would they bother doing it today? Of course not, "it's not cost effective" I reckon the studios are wallys in thinking the old forms don't offer the high level of visuals they reckon people expect from their cinema ticket.
CGI is emotionless...The reason why that skeleton fight still stands up today is because even the lamen can appreciate the complexity of whats going on there, hand animating 6 skeletons to fight against invisible targets, you don;t need schooling in efx work to realise that, it just comes through..the Cgi in that trailer is so inconceivably ridiculous its beyond anyones grasp how it was achieved and thus can not be truly appreciated, it's so sterile.. it negates the human aspect completely.

[V Knid esq]

Have you seen Coraline, Phil? 100% stop motion and, I reckon, brilliant.

[7875]

The Road looks good.
you see, started out being a good book.
at least they have something to go by.

Jason and the Argonauts was a great movie.
thanks for posting that link.

[The Physicist]

film makers are also remaking Total Recal

[phil2]

well depressing news.

[decadnids]

film makers are also remaking Total Recal

can't believe it.... if they are gonna make a PKD film, why remake an old one? why not pick another one of his stories and make it into a good film?

[Brownthing]

that's lame.
The best bit in Total recall is the sound when Arnie breaks that guys neck. Always makes me shout 'Yes!' (not outloud though obviously).

[phil2]

can't believe it.... if they are gonna make a PKD film, why remake an old one? why not pick another one of his stories and make it into a good film?

cashing in on the name i guess... sad...Verhoven needs to come back and take it back to basics.

[soulcheck]

poor Verhoven. They're doing a robocop reboot as well after all.

[Orang Utan]

that's lame.
The best bit in Total recall is the sound when Arnie breaks that guys neck. Always makes me shout 'Yes!' (not outloud though obviously).

the best bit for me is when he uses the guys body as a shield on the escalator

[Orang Utan]

can't believe it.... if they are gonna make a PKD film, why remake an old one? why not pick another one of his stories and make it into a good film?


cos total recall is tried and tested - why would they risk making a mindfuck of a film of a new story when they know total recall worked and will probably work with a reboot?

[decadnids]

cos total recall is tried and tested - why would they risk making a mindfuck of a film of a new story when they know total recall worked and will probably work with a reboot?

Plenty of PKD films have been made since Total Recall...



Total Recall (1990)
Based on "We Can Remember It For You Wholesale"

Confessions d'un Barjo (French, 1992)
Based on "Confessions of a Crap Artist"

Screamers (1995)
Based on "Second Variety"

Impostor (2001)
Based on "Impostor."

Minority Report (2002)
Based on "The Minority Report."

Paycheck (December 25, 2003)
Based on "Paycheck."

A Scanner Darkly (July 7, 2006)
Based on "A Scanner Darkly"

Next (April 27, 2007)
Based on "The Golden Man"

[Orang Utan]

only minority report was what hollywood would consider a success though.
it takes a director with serious clout to persuade the suits to try out something new. usually they'd rather remake than innovate it seems.

[Loz]

You've only got to see the amount of remake films coming out these days. Back in the 80s and 90s, most films were original stories, or based on books. Now a lot of films coming out are sequels and remakes.

I can only think of 2 remakes which are actually good: Invasion of the Body Snatchers (the 70s one with Donald Sutherland) and Scarface.

Oh, just thought of John Carpenter's The Thing, too.


Anyone name any other good remakes?

[soulcheck]

The blob was allright imo.

[phil2]

Brewster's Millions

[Orang Utan]

You've only got to see the amount of remake films coming out these days. Back in the 80s and 90s, most films were original stories, or based on books. Now a lot of films coming out are sequels and remakes.

I can only think of 2 remakes which are actually good: Invasion of the Body Snatchers (the 70s one with Donald Sutherland) and Scarface.

Oh, just thought of John Carpenter's The Thing, too.


Anyone name any other good remakes?
maltese falcon
ocean's eleven
the fly
the beat my heart skipped

[Hectic Cum Balthazar]

"the man who new too much"

granted... Hitchcock remaking his own film is in a class of its own...

[thembuzz]

its a little far fetched to think a render farm requires no material waste, it's mainlining the gas, oil and coal.

yes, alright, smartarse. with your 'science'

[thembuzz]

Have you seen Coraline, Phil? 100% stop motion and, I reckon, brilliant.

yeah, selick is a bit of a genius at that