techno blah blah...

[aleks]

there is no intelligent techno... and why is cristian´s or ruben´s etc stuff not techno? because it is harder to write?


this is taken from the announcement thread...so it not out of context

[aleks]

music is not intelligent...

[decadnids]

I agree aleks. I dont like the term intelligent used in musick.
like IDM...

[Weishaupt]

music can be inteligent

[pille'ocheoni]

no thats what i meant cristians, and ruben stuff for example is hard to write but not really, if thats the only way you write.............its intelegent though.........dont you think?

do you not judge music by technicality and delivery?

or just fun lalalal, danceable stuff.............

[jukka]

maybe the producer is intelligent but not the music as itself :-p

[aleks]

music is either good or bad...

[jukka]

word aleks !!

[decadnids]

do you not judge music by technicality and delivery?
no not really, I judge it on how it makes me feel.
the technicality I don't care about, it can be simple or complex, technical or non-technical, clever or not clever.

[Weishaupt]

Originally posted by jukka
maybe the producer is intelligent but not the music as itself :-p
disagree

for sure music can be inteligent.
i had this discus with toby. he said, music is just a thing. i said, music is alive................and can talk with u.......

[pille'ocheoni]

than what the fuck is intelegent.......you guys have too many word barriers to deal with................your so afraid to say the word intelegent or experimental, or good.............i have never heard the words spoken without redicule.

if it isnt intelegent than what is music...........its not thought? its not of the mind? its not of action, and planning? its not of skill, and pratcing of that skill?

what is your defintion of intelegence?

[jukka]

either i like the music or don't like it

[pille'ocheoni]

word up holgo

[aleks]

i feel music if it feels good it is good...if not than not. whether it is danceable very technical whatsoever or not...and if a simple 4-to-the-floor track makes me feel good than it is a good tune, i don´t care about anything else then

[decadnids]

[i]

what is your defintion of intelegence? [/B]

thats the big question mate.
hence the reason why I dont use the word intelligent for musick.

[Weishaupt]

Originally posted by pille'ocheoni
what is your defintion of intelegence?

not me

[aleks]

Originally posted by pille'ocheoni
if it isnt intelegent than what is music...........its not thought? its not of the mind? its not of action, and planning? its not of skill, and pratcing of that skill?

what is your defintion of intelegence?

music is music...nothing else. it can convey and evoke feelings and emotions that´s all to me...and that´s the most important aspect. take away the emotions and what have you got then? nothing...

[decadnids]

well put aleks.

[aleks]

and i cannot define intelligence at all...not in terms of music.

but it seems like that if it is experimental it must be intelligent...if not than it´s dumb or what? dumb music for dumb people, huh?

[decadnids]

not into the term experimental either ;( don't like many words me!

[aleks]

not-4-to-the floor=experimental=intelligent

[phil]

what a gay thread.

[Weishaupt]

Originally posted by phil
what a gay thread.

than go home:-)

[pille'ocheoni]

well, ok..............i understand now..............thats cool...........

music is very differnt to me, as a math operation is a complex algorythm which takes thought and time, music for me combines this and the envoking of emotion. for the combination of both produces a harmony of the dualisms of life.............without thought or "intelegence" life is singular, but with the harmony of ones spirtualism and thought, progress as as human race is possible. thats how is see the progress of music as intelegence.

[phil]

pille,your talking a load of old harry secombe bollocks.

[decadnids]

Originally posted by phil
what a gay thread.

gay techno?

[decadnids]

Originally posted by pille'ocheoni
if i ever see you little punk ass i will beat you to a fucking bloody pulp, you fuck

brave words when you are sitting behind a computer the other side of the world....

[pille'ocheoni]

you dont know me.............brave actions if the time presents itself.

americans arnt afriad of kicking the shit out of little skinny brit fucks.........

and why do you always take phils side...almost encouraging him..........you have always been the anti lover.........always disagreeing with everyone........

why is this? and do you have beef with me? cause i have none with you

[emef]

c`mon now ladies
this is a local board for local freaks

[decadnids]

Chill Pille, I wasn't dissing americans
you seem a little highly strung.
as for phil's "side" - I know phil personally, so it stands to reason dunnit.

I dont always disagree with everyone, i was agreeing with Aleks in this thread.

as for beef, I don;t eat meat.

A NOTE TO ALL - please dont take me too seriously.
as gurdjieff says "don't take things too sirius...."

[pille'ocheoni]

cool................english humour or whatever you guys call it, is a bit confusing innit..........

yeah im a bit high strung considering a english fuck named phil always has the most crude things to say........"dark humour" "just fucking around" yeah yeah yeah..............you dont always have some fuck down your throat cus your an american........

look, everyone says calm down..........but i never hear this towards anybody else giving insults. jesus christ. this board has turned

[pille'ocheoni]

fuck this dont take things seriously.................then dont say them...............i have never got any english humour to this date...............its crude,rude and distastefull. if my name is included in a insult or soemone i consider a freind, im spossed to say" oh that was soo funny, gosh those english guys are so funny, they just love making these little funny comment.......awww gesh"

[decadnids]

pille, you need to relax mate, and step away from the keyboard and do some deep breathing or something.

words, on a screen, its hard to envoke the same feeling as when you are having a discussion with people face to face, I am sure if you where sitting in the same room and the same conversation was happening there would be no anger shit going down.

you gotta remember that when you have only the written word to go on that you got to take it with a pinch of salt now and again and not assume everything is a personal attack.

I have no beef with anyone.

[decadnids]

pille it is about acceptance. I accept the way other cultures are represented on this board, and deal with it. dont let yourself get so wound up, its not good for you.

[Lady E]

oh stop squabbling.

i would ignore phil when he mentions the words 'harry' and 'secombe'

i HATE it when people lik taxi-drivers ask me what i do and i tell them and then they want to know what kind of music it is. i usually say electronic music and then that is a surefire way to stop any more questions. calling it experimental music is fairly meaningless when you think about it but unfortunately adjectives are needed so we know a little bit more we are referring to when we talk about music

i also dont have a problem with describing music as intelligent although i wouldnt use that as a genre. of course ALL descriptions will be subjective but i think it is possible to convey some meaning even in these polyvalent times.

intelligent IS used undoubtedly as a hierarchical term implying that there is an opposite which is stupid and privileging the former...but i wouldnt necessarily use intelligent just to describe 'difficult' or complex music. if i can call a person intelligent i can call books, art, music, food, fashion - anythign a person creates 'intelligent' if i feel that's what it is.it doesnt equate in my book to 'educated'.i respond emotionally to people's ingenuity, their brilliance, their wit and cleverness. this to me is intelligence.

[decadnids]

I guess for descriptive terms intelligent is pretty useful.
as you say not so good as a genre label...

[pille'ocheoni]

i agree................

and decanids you have no idea what is good for me...........minimizing my feelings to some minor mis-understanding is preety fucking rude..........and i dont appreciate it

[decadnids]

sorry Pille, to me it is a miss-understanding.
nothing else I can say really, I still got no beef with you.

[Lady E]

pille, dont get upset please. everyone gets told to calm down not just you. phil loves winding people up, just ignore him.

honestly - the brits can be funny... please dont take a nations humour from the example of philie-T. that would be a tragedy!

and i dont think the 'board has turned' into anything more or less than the motley collection of freaks with too much to say that its always been.

what a day!!

[decadnids]

Emma, it is april fools day after all!
check the fool in the tarot... ;)

[pille'ocheoni]

and if you understand all cultures on the board then why arte you teeling me to calm down?

i dont always take thing personally unless its my name in a singualr comment like " pille die".

nobody ever stands up to this fuck and i know that is what he wants, but when will it stop? i never do this. and nobody else ever does this...........i respond rash sometimes, just because i feel i need too.............

why is it when ever someone has a problem everyone wants to shut it up, but when its a troll , everyone says "aww aint that cute?"

[decadnids]

Pille, mate. there is nothing I can say anymore that will sort this out.

I havn't a problem with anyone or what anyone writes on this board.
it is a good board that allows the freedom of expression.

[zombie ritual]

Anyone remember Studio 1, early Profan, or Plastikman, or mid-90ies Robert Hood? Now that music was maximally stripped down, seemingly far from complex, but nobody would ever have had the idea to call it dumb. Rather the opposite.

Once I heard of an experiment in which young students were exposed to either music of Mozart or minimal music of Phil Glass. After that they had to solve mathematical tasks. The "Mozart-group" did significantly better than the "Phil Glass-group", but only shortly after music exposure. With a longer interval between exposure and experimental task, the differences disappeared. It was concluded that the complexity of music was the determining factor for the differences. That made me think a bit. Whether you accept the conclusion or not (what would have happened if e.g. one group had been exposed to Schönberg?), I wonder sometimes whether the absence of long melodies or complex harmonic changes in modern forms of music (not just techno) is making us all more stupid or at least does nothing to train our brains. But then, it's not the purpose of music to make us all better at math is it?

[pille'ocheoni]

emma i would never classify all english as being a phil...............
fuck it..........once again, i never mean to problematic, quite the opposite...........

and decanids i will never hold beef with you, all i would want to do i to better understand were your coming from. thats it.........

and i feel i give this board alot of love, and support. i give my oponions, my thoughts, my arguments, and my heart.

peace/pille'

[decadnids]

interesting stuff zombie ritual.

there is a lot of musick (modern) that have long melodies and complex harmonic changes... but I can see where you are coming from. especially in pop music and stuff like that.

[decadnids]

Originally posted by pille'ocheoni


and decanids i will never hold beef with you, all i would want to do i to better understand were your coming from. thats it.........

and i feel i give this board alot of love, and support. i give my oponions, my thoughts, my arguments, and my heart.

peace/pille' [/B]

where am I coming from? I am just a bloke who likes to post on boards like this, as it seems like there are a lot of interesting people there, some-times I play the devils advocate, as I think it is healthy for people to think about their views and stuff. I do not intend to attack people, and as far as I am aware I do not hurl insults at others on here.

does that help?

[Lady E]

pille id just interpret it as affection from phil to be honest. he's rude to all his friends too. and he gets challenged all the time if he's a wanker, which to be fair he hasnt been for ages.

i agree its hard sometimes to not respond angrily to people, and sometimes its really necessary. but i have to work hard NOT to be angry too much of the time because i have a temper no-one would like to see in full flow. so i find trying to ignore total twats who are trying to wind me up really helps me, although i do fail, often!

[pille'ocheoni]

no zombie i dont think so either.............but to get out of the box, one needs to deiscover it in whole right...........

math is everything

and i agree, most ppl that have tons of musical trainings, have a hard time getting out of the box............but i beleive there is a happy medium.............

this is just my opionion.

[pille'ocheoni]

yes that does help................i always thought you were serious.............

because of the lack of smiley's, which i know becomes tacky at times...but i understand, and this was good for all of us wasnt it? i think it was, especially for me.........

@emma, thanks for saying that..........i fully understand that statement..............and as for blowing up, im tired of trying to be the wise one that takes things in stride..........letting these things come out i beleive is good, if its not hurting anyone.........i do enough of the wise,calm,colective in my daliy life. this board helps me be human

[zombie ritual]

I've been speculating that the human brain needs a medium amount of tonal information to improve some abilities, i.e. not too little, not too much (which would actually sound like noise to us). Plus I wondered what effect the abandonement of tonality in academic music has on us. They should have compared Mozart with Schönberg, really.

And decadnits: which modern music with long melodies and complex harmonic changes (that is not atonal) are you thinking of??

[marcel]

Originally posted by zombie ritual
Anyone remember Studio 1, early Profan, or Plastikman, or mid-90ies Robert Hood? Now that music was maximally stripped down, seemingly far from complex, but nobody would ever have had the idea to call it dumb.

of course not, dont confound stripped to the essence with using only a lil amount of ideas. thats what you imply with this rethoric question

[gunjack]

i too am feeling very high strung these days. i think the fact that we americans are looked so far down upon recently contributes to my own already hightened paranoia.

[phdbob]

god saves the queen?

[Lady E]

I certainly dont equate the americans i know with the actions of their government. as 'we' are in coalition you certainly shouldnt get that bigotry from any UK citizens anyway.

[invisibleplanet]

Originally posted by gunjack
i too am feeling very high strung these days. i think the fact that we americans are looked so far down upon recently contributes to my own already hightened paranoia.

² gunjack and any other American reading no-future (http://www.no-future.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&postid=36805)

[phdbob]

very true...since there is no actual democracy (gov does what people want) how could you blame anyone...western democrat politics are just a very sublte way of supression...the gain of today rulers is to find the supession/tolerance ratio... give some freedom and fun here...take some there...

[Mirsha]

We'll call it intillgent trip core and end the debate. A new genre is born, hail to the masters.

[pille'ocheoni]

see guys............@ip's post confuses me, was that an insult? i have no fucking clue. she means well at heart but damn if i dont know what the fuck that means.ahhhhh.

@gunny, we are in the same boat brotha...........im just confused now.

[invisibleplanet]

how about we call it techyes?

[pille'ocheoni]

its just got to a point of shit..........

[Marolo]

the best thing about America is Texas punk rock - the Dicks, Butthole Surfers, Scratch Acid, Big Boys, stickmen with rayguns, Cherubs etc...

[marcel]

Originally posted by invisibleplanet
how about we call it techyes?

sounds nice

[gunjack]

Originally posted by pille'ocheoni
@ip's post confuses me, was that an insult? i have no fucking clue. she means well at heart but damn if i dont know what the fuck that means.ahhhhh.

i feel ya. ip - care to explain?

[thetonewrecker]

adding another piece of thought.

I don't "hear" music like the general public anymore. I haven't for many years and it seems normal to me now. I don't interrpret a song in it's entire whole and think of it as a body of work anymore if that makes any sense. I hear things and I reverse engineer them. How'd they make that sound, what's going on there, would I leave that rhythm patten like they did, or would I change something. Hmm, that meloday is nice, but I would've changed those two notes and maybe not had this one part repeat, and on and on and on. It's like some ongoing critical analysis, but many times it's very good thoughts because I'm a fan of so many artists.

It is a blessing and a curse, but I think as more people work and create their own music, you have a population of people that "want to be surprised" by what they hear. Whether this "surprise" is a new melody that sticks with the listener, or some unusual sound, or more often an unusual beat, it becomes increasingly difficult and frustrating to listen to things and not have your brain immediately say "ok, heard it before..next".

Drop the "Intelligence" moniker and switch it to "Long Attention Span Music" Hey, LASM that's kinda catchy.. nah

[zombie ritual]

@ marcel: of course I like to think as well, that it's stripped to the essence rather than lack of ideas. But do you have a proof? How do you even know it was NOT a lack of ideas?

[marcel]

@tonewrecker totally the same what i experienced since i started making music!
its so frustrating sometimes cause you cant relax to that much music anymore, always starting automatically to analyse it.argh
some time ago i thought about the fact that so many people are here on the board who are making active music or are at least some kind of musicaddicts. i think it has some thing to do with that fact you mentioned tonewrecker. nf-stuff is mostly different,surprising forwardthinking and so on. the best for us 'analysers'!;)

@zombie of course you cant know. and to be honest i dont like the most of that minimal stuff. and i bet that at least 80% of it is because of a lack of ideas or because of ideology(or,maybe mostly, both).
anyhow, thats not what its about, you like the track or not, whatever reason the artist had to make it the way it is. but
sometimes i think you can hear it, i mean if there was a lack of ideas or not. these tracks are mostly bad at all, but hey maybe im wrong. who matters?

[pille'ocheoni]

word up tonewrecker!

[big raff]

you people need a holiday

[DsD]

Originally posted by gunjack
i too am feeling very high strung these days. i think the fact that we americans are looked so far down upon recently contributes to my own already hightened paranoia.

just one stupid question... why is there always a "english - american" fight?
we all like music and i don`t think that the country we are from is interessting.

(gunjack i just took ur post cause it is short and about that stuff. nothing personal. ;) )

[7875]

i've been making music (or at least attempting to) for almost ten years now and over that time have gotten into the habit of deconstructing all the elements of what makes one song work while another fails. there can sometimes be the feeling that there to much critical analysis and that ruins the whole appreciation aspect of it. there has been alot of music that i have no idea how in the hell it was achieved/performed and those pieces remind how very little i know about music. can i really consider myself a musician if i don't know how to read a note of music?

[invisibleplanet]

²7875
can i really consider myself a musician if i don't know how to read a note of music?

using non-musical terminology, it sounds ²me as though u are using William Burrough's 'cut up' technique to make music.
i am certain that there are many methods to make music. muscial notation is one traditional method; the method u use is possibly quite popular nowadays, and i've heard of several other people who construct their music by deconstructing other people's music, and join it back together again.

[invisibleplanet]

Originally posted by gunjack


i feel ya. ip - care to explain?

i feel i've explained already in the Hypocrisy thread.
if it's not enough for u, then plz say so there, thxal :!

[pille'ocheoni]

:(

[thetonewrecker]

Originally posted by 7875
can i really consider myself a musician if i don't know how to read a note of music?

sure, why not. I would say that under certain studio conditions and writing styles for your music it would be completely irrelevant. If you are sequencing your instruments and have a pile of control changes and whatnot changing the sound over any entered notes to create a certain tone, it is of no use to be able to read, or write musical notation. Within this expanding electronic instrumental world, the traditional keyboard is playing a less important role as to being able to play and read/write musical notation. Anyways, why would you want to be limited to 12 measely pitches in a given octave. Well, you could always tune your stuff like Sonic Youth. :-)


Speaking from experience, I've written entire tracks with only 1 note on the keyboard being pressed simply to trigger the synths, but all the tones change in bursts or chords from tuning oscillators and other control messages. I don't need to know that G/B-flat/D make up a g-minor chord to be able to dial in the frequencies to make it sound right to my ears.

I think you'd be more accurate to call yourself a musician/conductor/studio engineer/producer/occasional wrestler to sum up all involved with writing music on your own these days in the electronic studio.