Downloading is Killing Music?

[joe pinapples]

http://www.spoiltvictorianchild.co.uk /images/downloading.gif

Just like Home Taping did before!?!?

http://journals.concrete.org.au/patrick/bowie

Just look what happened to poor D. Bowie's bank account after the home-made mixtape revolution!

[Roy Shaw]

Well, firstly I would say this. Can you stop the rain? Your answer should be no. Because while you can use an umbrella say you can never fully stop it. To stop the rain would mean to erect a canopy that covers the whole of planet earth and besides the obvious logistical problems one would encounter the real problem would be dinosaur resurrection through fake osmosis.

Anyway your initial concern relating to the death of music interests me. Let us take the word you used 'Killing' I suspect this has been used to describe the decline in sales attributed to the proliferation of file sharing applications like Soul Seek and Limewire. IF you have actual verified statistics showing this is the case I would recommend you show them. If however this topic exists merely to highlight the similar scare tactics used by large companies back in the early eighties then I would agree with you whole-heartedly.

Music cannot be killed. Music is like The Highlander. You would have to chop off its head. And lets be honest, when has music had a head.

Yours

Roy.

[joe pinapples]

First of all I want to say, ROY SHAW, thanks for answering my thread about the DANGERS of downloading! Yes indeed I agree with your extremely salient point!



Well done especially for logging in as the correct user and not answering in the voice of ROY SHAW when logged in as PHIL!! LOL OMG!

[Roy Shaw]

A somewhat trite response to my probing questions. Firstly, let me ask you this.
If a man was to download but one music file (Mp3 or wav) a day for the rest of his life (baring hospital admittance etc) then how many files do you think he would have accumilated? Don't answer that because i have worked it out already. about 30,000 songs give or take. Put into perspective that equates to around 120,000 hours of music. What price do you put on music? In my humble opinion music should not be sold at all. Music is not about ownership but about enjoyment. Therefore if he the man with 120,000 hours of music downloaded from a website is happy then what is the problem? I could argue about capatalism till the cows move home and eat all the grass but what purpose would that serve? none, other than self gratification. I will tell you this for free and you don't even have to download it.

Bye.mp3 (imagine if files didn't have a dot in them. Think about it.)

[joe pinapples]

I 'googled' 'Roy Shaw' and then used the popular 'Image' option - Imagine my utter surprise when all the images were of the popular internet image 'Goatse' - Roy, what on earth can this mean?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goatse

Are you the 'Goatse' man? Or did you simply pose and take the photgraphs for a close, dear friend? How great that you found yer way onto the 'No-Future' Mongboard fraternity - you, an internet LEGEND!

[Roy Shaw]

Maybe when you stop trying to be a comedian we can have an intelligent discussion on the very relevant topic you started.
Let me know when you have left the playground.

Roy.

[joe pinapples]

Efters Chiefy!

[Sheridan]

downloading isn't killing music.
shitty music is killing music.

[invisibledan]

i wonder if apple like them depicting that the ipod is killing music?

[penciLneck]

DRM will kill music.

[JE:5]

downloading isn't killing music.
shitty music is killing music.


Spot on.

[joe pinapples]

i wonder if apple like them depicting that the ipod is killing music?

Its a joke/pisstake done on a Mp3 Weblog page that is quite good sometimes -

http://www.spoiltvictorianchild.co.uk /

Downloading isnt killing music its making it much, much better.

[JonnySpeed]

downloading is killing shitty music

[joe pinapples]

http://www.r107.co.uk/images/blogdial/ipod-killing.png

Heres another version . .

I dont think Downloading is even killing bad music or having a limiting effect on any type of music.

[Roy Shaw]

This thread would benefit from less images and more dialogue. You see Joe, if i may call you Joe. You have simply repeated yourself and no one on this message board is any the wiser in respect to how downloading is killing music.

[joe pinapples]

Thanks again for responding Roy Shaw poster - downloading isn't really killing music - quite the opposite!

[ckpqerjwrpwp]

I'm pretty sure nothing will kill music.

[joe pinapples]

I'm pretty sure nothing will kill music.


If music can survive the musical career of Bruce Willis, nothing can destroy it:

http://www.uso.org/pubs/uploads/BRUCE_WILLIS_CAMP_FOX_SING_web .jpg

What a treat for the soldiers fighting in Iraq! Bruce wanted to go fight in the the Iraq war, but he was too old so he went and dressed up like a soldier and sang blues songs and played the 'harp' . . What a numpty.

[V Knid esq]

http://www.r107.co.uk/images/blogdial/ipod-killing.png

Heres another version . .

I dont think Downloading is even killing bad music or having a limiting effect on any type of music.


Sadly not true. Small labels and underground music have been hit the hardest by downloading. Hopefully new distribution models might change that, and certainly the advent of things like Bleep and Epitonic have helped to bring an income stream back, but I'm sure Emma, Cris and others on this board can back up from direct experience how hard it is to turn a profit when people can get your music for nothing.

[joe pinapples]

I'm downloadin some Bruce Willis now - I refuse to pay £27.00 for a Japanese import 12" vinyl, just because its a picture disc!

[Roy Shaw]

I'm downloadin some Bruce Willis now - I refuse to pay £27.00 for a Japanese import 12" vinyl, just because its a picture disc!

Amusing im sure but you made a statement in your last post to the effect of music is fine don't worry about it. V Knid then stated an example of why you are wrong, you responded off topic with some refference to an act of piracy you may or may not commit. Hardly one for advancing debate are you. Buck up lad.

[Loz]

http://www.uso.org/pubs/uploads/BRUCE_WILLIS_CAMP_FOX_SING_web .jpg


what was Michael J Fox doing there?

[FiST]

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y153/iamfist/homebakingiskillinggreggs.jpg

[joe pinapples]

lol

[Roy Shaw]

Maybe In Scotland everything is taken with a pinch of salt. Could that be the reason so many Scotish people have left Scotland. Too many pinches of salt. a pinch of salt too far maybe.

[decadnids]

and others on this board can back up from direct experience how hard it is to turn a profit when people can get your music for nothing.

dunno, i just opted for the simpler model, and offered people a place so people could get music for nothing.

[Yer_Maw]

Sadly not true. Small labels and underground music have been hit the hardest by downloading.

well they should have been best placed to innovate when downloading hit.

[Roy Shaw]

well they should have been best placed to innovate when downloading hit.



I find that comment to have errors. How does being small and independant equate to being 'best placed to innovate'? Surely it would be the opposite. Considering selling music online requires a huge marketing effort which would cost millions. Where do you get your information from? The thin air?

[joe pinapples]

what was Michael J Fox doing there?

Michael was on a top secret mission . . He was going to reprise his role in "Doc Hollywood" except in real life, and in the Iraqi city of Falluja! Crashing his Abrams Armoured Personel Carrier into a local fence, Michael is forced to work as a local Doctor until the huge vehicle is fixed by the local garage. With heartwarming, romantic consequences!

[infiniti]

I'm sure that the small labels have seen a decline in sales over the years, although I've yet to see direct evidence linking this to filesharing. I can download a copy of the music, I still can't download the vinyl, until then, I still buy vinyl. I think I speak for a lot of people into this music, but filesharing has only increased my appetite for buying and knowledge of music.

There are so many other factors which affect the sales of what is a minority taste in music, first and foremost being that in general, there are less people getting into electronic music, especially techno (Cris still makes techno, or techno-inspired music, does he not?). The bunch of mates who first turned me onto his music are now into the Editors and the Arctic Monkeys, as far as they're concerned, techno died a long time ago (I know differently). Trends change.

Add to this that those that are still into it are now all grown up with kids and mortgages, and therefore less income to spend on vinyl. The glory days are over, for electronic music, I used to spend a fortune on records, week in, week out, there's no way I can afford it these days. I still buy, only not as blindly as I once did.

[Roy Shaw]

I'm sure that the small labels have seen a decline in sales over the years, although I've yet to see direct evidence linking this to filesharing. I can download a copy of the music, I still can't download the vinyl, until then, I still buy vinyl. I think I speak for a lot of people into this music, but filesharing has only increased my appetite for buying and knowledge of music.

There are so many other factors which affect the sales of what is a minority taste in music, first and foremost being that in general, there are less people getting into electronic music, especially techno (Cris still makes techno, or techno-inspired music, does he not?). The bunch of mates who first turned me onto his music are now into the Editors and the Arctic Monkeys, as far as they're concerned, techno died a long time ago (I know differently). Trends change.

Add to this that those that are still into it are now all grown up with kids and mortgages, and therefore less income to spend on vinyl. The glory days are over, for electronic music, I used to spend a fortune on records, week in, week out, there's no way I can afford it these days. I still buy, only not as blindly as I once did.


Your friends are into 'The Editors and the Artic monkeys'. It is in my opinion that your friends have tastes based on trends. Thus my conclusion no matter how shallow is that your friends are not sturdy people of solid character. I could be wrong of course.

[grobelaar]

Not just in music, but in most industries whose foundation is some spark of creativity - they seemed to be getting bogged down in asking their customers what they want...

The problem I see with that, is that 90% of people are going to ask for that really good thing that they had last time. What they fail to realise is that what made some of it really good, was that it was really new, so when the film/record/game company churns out Version 2-10 of 'What Everyone Really LIkes'. Everyone slowly realises that they don't like it and don't buy it...

The fact remains that no focus group, or marketing team or Excel spreadsheet is ever going to be able to analyse whether something new will be good and popular.

I mean computer games and films its kind of more understandable, they cost milllions of dollars to make, but music? It's not a massive outlay (in the grand scheme of things) to try something new - but alas most of the 'popular, heavily marketed music in the shops has a shocking lack of any orginality to it...

Not to mention that the music itself is then pumped out of every shop, radio station, public toilet, tv adverts, tv idents etc etc. So that the average joe public is litterally awash with this shit - is it any surprise when they download it for free and don't think that that is a crime... I mean I'm sure by the time a Coldplay albums hits the shops shelves the airplay it's received must have paid for its cost many times over...

[Yer_Maw]

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/cool/view/

good ruskoff documentry about marketing and teenagers. Brilliant stuff about limp bizkit, insane clown posse etc and how they have actually managed use them as marketing tools. anyhoo grobelar, loads of points you mentioned in the docu, its well good.

[JonnySpeed]

Small labels and underground music have been hit the hardest by downloading.

I do have to question that because it's virtually impossible to get stuff off small underground labels on P2P networks - the nature of P2P means that only the popular stuff gets enough mass to be available for download - sure there is the odd more popular track but never the most recent stuff. Vinyl is the only way to get a copy of virtually everything I buy - unless you're on something like Soul Seek and connected to a fanatical specialist like Bibi and Marv

[Spandex]

ar.. I just don't buy the "downloading music hurts small labels". I wouldn't have even heard of half the music I now own if audiogalaxy had never happened.

Small labels may well be suffering.. but that's not because people download music. It's cos large corporations are doing the same thing with music that they've done with newspapers, food, clothes, furniture, bookshops etc.

The first reaction of the media is always to blame individual consumers.. and therefore this becomes "the truth". It's like "buy british" and "recycle cans" and "save energy"... it might make a tiny difference and be worth doing, but it's a drop in the ocean compared to where the real damage is being done.

[Yer_Maw]

ah audiogalaxy was amazin. Great stuff, used to sit and dload tunes in uni and they were on my computer when i got home. those were the days.

[joe pinapples]

ah audiogalaxy was amazin. Great stuff, used to sit and dload tunes in uni and they were on my computer when i got home. those were the days.

You do realise all those Frankie Goes To Hollywood remixes you downloaded have meant that Holly Johnson was unable to have his conservatory roof re-panelled until late November 2002? No you dont realise, I wonder - do you care at all?!?!?

[infiniti]

Your friends are into 'The Editors and the Artic monkeys'. It is in my opinion that your friends have tastes based on trends. Thus my conclusion no matter how shallow is that your friends are not sturdy people of solid character. I could be wrong of course.

So what has this got to do with the argument on filesharing?

[ckpqerjwrpwp]

Oh Audiogalaxy.

[Roy Shaw]

So what has this got to do with the argument on filesharing?


Accept my apologies. Onwards and upwards. File sharing. Sharing. Let me try to explain my thoughts on Sharing.

If I make a song at I like it I will share it with friends. If they share it with their friends then so be it. I simply do not believe in making money from music. It is wrong.

[Spandex]

Oh Audiogalaxy.

hehehe... hallowed be thy DNS entries.

[e_wann]

just wanted to say that i do download music, my mate got loads of copied dvd movies and a converted xbox with a 160GB HD, but i do buy my vinyl and somethimes a cd and movies, my mate often goes renting a game or movie and copy onto his HD , its just a new industrie were their aint much money making for the artists indeed but you cant stop squid from floating in the oceans. but nowadays you can buy via itunes for 0,99cent a song. and its like wise ze early days it was illegal to tape movies from tv onto vhs but every nucking family had a vhs. you cant stop new technologies or try to alike sony with its protection/trace system , they got blamed for it. just let it buzz

[Loz]

I don't like the idea of buying mp3s, especially mp3s with DRM.

It's just because mp3s to me seem a temporary thing. I've lost mp3s more than a few times due to hard drive crashes (recently around 40% of my mp3s were corrupted thanks to windows checkdisk) and I would have to pay for them again, and I don't think that's fair.

I really hope they don't stop making CD releases of albums, because if you're buying an mp3 album for 7.99 off itunes, I'd prefer to buy the actual record for 2 pounds more, which gives you more control over it, and you get the artwork and everything.

[e_wann]

yeah my too , sure thing is that , you get a nice cover and booklet, but i was pointing for people who would like to go only mp3. ps loz don't you write yer mp3s on dvd or so? ive around 11 dvd with djsets tho, not as much mp3tracks but that would make a diff. or an external backup disk

[Loz]

I ought to burn them onto DVD, especially now I've got a DVD burner

[e_wann]

but in another way, nothing will last 4ever , even dvd and cd can crash after XXX years innit? but we have an cd archive of all work from the printings and they last already about 10-15 years, i will let it know when the first cracks starting , then we know when to rearchive it

[mdk]

to me seem a temporary thing.

all once was dust and shall dust again becometh.

Entropy and Extropy the yin and yang of matter. whereby m = E / (c * c)

Thus spake marvathustra.