Stop the War

[grobelaar]

Cool, pro-peace video here...

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/video/redux.html

Also there's a Stop the War demonstration going on the 15th February in London. I'll be going, if anyone else want to join me give us a shout.

http://www.stopwar.org.uk/

That's if 'they' haven't already kicked off by then. I have to say this shit is really scaring me, having grown up in west germany through the coldwar and having my father feed me loads of classified info about nuclear weapons when I was kid - this is way way scarier, because at the end of the day once you got over the fact that both sides had enough weapons to blow the planet to pieces 10 times over, you knew they were never going to do it. There was dialogue between the two sides. I mean the President of the US and the USSR had phones in their offices so they could speak to each other at any time...

This is way scarier, not just because of terrorist threats. I was listening to some show on Radio 5 a few days ago and the host was asking people how they felt about the Prime Minister putting us on alert for a terrorist strike... Who gives a shit, how do you think the poeple of Iraq feel knowing that we are parking Aircraft carriers the size of cities with cruise missiles and nuclear strike capability right on their doorstep. From my point of view it seems like the west are pursue a pure rhetorical standpoint, they aren't even trying to understand or have dialogue with their supposed elusive enemy.

I think perhaps the demise of the USSR may have been a bad thing, at least their was an equilibrium, perhaps not a perfect one, but a balance nonetheless...

[zongkong]

well, I'll be going, not in london though, but here in piteå or luleå.

"I think perhaps the demise of the USSR may have been a bad thing, at least their was an equilibrium, perhaps not a perfect one, but a balance nonetheless..."

sure, there was a terror balance, however is that something to build a world of peace upon..?

if nothing else, think of the simply huge amount of resources it takes to maintain such a balance.


not that I'm sure that the terror balance of the old days have been replaced with something better..
anyway peace out.

[piscaries]

if i had know that bush was going to be in chicago the other day, i would have joined in the protests. it was apparently a small turn out (a few hundred people maybe), but it seems that wherever he goes there's at least some group of people there to demonstrate against him and his war. it all seems to be getting media attention too. i hope this impedes him (if even just a little) from using hostile force to resolve things. the more attention the demonstrations get, the less the general misinformed public will believe that the world is unified in a war on iraq. but just to be safe, get your radiation suit or make sure you're as close as possible to ground zero...

[emef]

i`m gonna try and make it...need to see if my mate will let me doss down on his floor.

[Sheridan]

all those 'high alert' warnings are nothing but ways to keep the general public scared and build tension among them so that they will support a war.

[grobelaar]

I've just heard on the news that the US are preparing to debrief a former Iraqi scientist in Cyprus who they say is going to provide the US with the evidence they need to give them an excuse to use force to disarm the Iraqis...

Sounds spurious to me - but it seems that the US are going to war no matter what...

[invisibleplanet]

quick, yes, must hurry to IRAQ as possible STOP
israeli election in next two weeks STOP
palestinian election next month STOP
mapping of israel must not stop STOP
roads must be built through palestine STOP


STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[c s]

Originally posted by Sheridan
all those 'high alert' warnings are nothing but ways to keep the general public scared and build tension among them so that they will support a war.

...and also accept the total destruction of civil rights, especially in the us, but also here in europe.

as for the balance of terror - perhaps it was in some way a better state, especially because russia today seems to be not too different from the cccp times. critical minded tv stations and newspapers get closed down, wars are fought in the south with no regards to human rights, reporters are refused to enter the area, money is spend on military and façade while hundreds of people freeze to death. so where's the advantage over soviet union ? cynical question, i know.

putin & bush make great comrades. :-\

[invisibleplanet]

until our so called 'democracy' holds a REFERENDUM of the PEOPLE, only then will we have TRUE democracy, instead of this thinly veiled Plutocracy, where wealth and big business wield the power and call the shots.

But of course, we are all so 'frightened' by the govt. propaganda machine, that we think all manner of people are enemies of the state, where in fact, it appears to be the Govt. itself who is the worst aggressor.

This war has been in planning for many years. I don't think the Yankee President will cease this war, until Europe takes a stand against the USA.

If the French and Germans lead here, and defend Iraq, I fear that Great Britain will continue to play piggy-in-the-middle, instead of being bold, and also taking a stand against the USA, and denouncing it's position as ally, and standing with it's true allies, the Europeans.

I hope ANY country who is currently working on a contract for the US military, uses the power they have to delay or even halt the delivery of more tools to the US which could enable them to execute their future military plans.

Why should it be that Iraq is getting all the attention here.

It seems so obvious that the increased pace to get the USA into IRAQ before the Israeli and Palestinian Elections take place, is more to do with the USA funded Invasion of Palestine, than to do with IRAQ being an immediate threat to the world.

[piscaries]

*and i'm proud to be an american...*

{please note the bitter sarcasm}

when i can actually afford to leave this place i will do it as quickly as possible. my government frightens me. bush's voice surely does not speak my thoughts.

[Sheridan]

Originally posted by piscaries
bush's voice surely does not speak my thoughts. [/B]

you mean that you don't think nigeria is a very important continent??:!

yes I feel the same you. I am not really scared of anyone on this planet except cowboy bush and all his cohorts.

here is a question: why does britian always back up the stuff we try and do? even if it is wrong? why doesn't anyone actually say no to us. I think if europe as a whole stood up as one and said no to the usa than that might rattle some teeth. what do you all think?

[Ava]

i'm gonna try and make it from bristol. hopefully ther'll be a bus running or something

[Lady E]

aah the "special relationship", which actually only the UK gives a shit about


a hangover from WWII compounded by thatch and reagan's love-in...

i really dont know the history of it...you can see why UK leaders might think it more cool than being in the EU though. shallow starry eyedness

scary times.

[wired]

yeah, it's a boring and frightening theme here in germany, too. most of the people here don't want any war, expecially this one. and we don't know where our government goes. some months ago chancellor schroeder said "no german actions in this war" but now i'm not shure if he still stands to his words, because big brother america is watching and the government don't wants to get the american's angry again...
bush is a war monger, i think he has fun to send his soldiers into death. yesterday evening i saw a reportage about america's first gulf war, and they showed some facts about which were not said before. this war over 10 years ago was a commercial oriented war to save the american's oil industry... the iraq's soldier had no chance against nuclear uran coated bullets, a american soldier said these soldiers were farmers, when they took the weapons of them, sand was inside... they had no idea what to do with it... they said that over 200000 old men, women and children died in the bomb rain of cruise missiles, fire bombs, and some special toys...
the second reportage they showed yesterday was about america's afghanistan war. how they searched for terrorists, and what big faults they made there, and what they made years before etc... big faults... they were so stupid, and the local warlords there used the stupidness of the americans to kill some of their enemys, civilian people, childrens...

i don't understand why george bush is so keen on war... killing people is never fun. it's wrong everytime... but i'm shure that the war comes... they want it so, equal what saddam and his bad guys make...

the second critical point of the world would be north korea... they want to build atom bombs soon... this land is poor, their people starve because of their government, and maybe it's the next land bush will attack...

i hate this...

[Sheridan]

I myself dont condone war, but with threats coming from iraq and north korea, north korea poses the biggest threat. they truly are working on 'weapons of mass destruction'. a term I find so ironic. what kind of weapons does the usa have? weapons of minor destruction? just because we can put a computer chip in a bomb and have it 'hit its target' without any loss to civilian life (yeah right) doesn't make it any less lethal and wrong. destruction is destruction is destruction. it is death either way you look at it. and it is all wrong.

[c s]

Originally posted by wired
some months ago chancellor schroeder said "no german actions in this war" but now i'm not shure if he still stands to his words, because big brother america is watching and the government don't wants to get the american's angry again...

but mainly because of economic reasons i guess. only economy has enough influence to be an argument in this.

while they sure want to occupy the world's second biggest oil producing country so they can continue using 25% of the world's oil production in order to enjoy "freedom", it's for sure the economy will go down once a war has started. it wasn't the same in 1991 when stock rates rised as soon as father bush attacked.

[m j]

ãì.......................... ...

[m j]

stop the pain now
stop the fear....
medecins sans frontieres...

from russian song

[invisibleplanet]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,872775,00.html

US MUST TOE THE UN LINE: report from uk's guardian newspaper

[gunjack]

http://www.templeofblood.com/~ncc386/ubb_images/guess_what.jpg

[invisibleplanet]

Germany on tightrope over election pledge (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,872750,00.html)


us military buildup (http://www.guardian.co.uk/flash/0,5860,791671,00.html)
british military build up (http://www.guardian.co.uk/flash/0,5860,863185,00.html)

The Jewish State born: report from Saturday May 15, 1948 (http://guardiancentury.co.uk/1940-1949/Story/0,6051,105109,00.html)
Orders have been given to the Egyptian armed forces to enter Palestine, with the object of restoring security and order in that country and putting an end to massacres perpetrated by terrorist Zionist gangs and against humanity.

Israel tests new missile system (http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,869238,00.html)
Israeli officials have been keen to play down the likelihood of a successful Iraqi missile attack this time around. They say intelligence reports indicate that Saddam Hussein has far fewer Scuds than before the 1991 conflict.

Jenin riddle: Why did an Israeli soldier shoot a British official in the back? (http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,855525,00.html)
Hook, 54, from Felixstowe in Suffolk, died on November 22 after the Israeli army swept into Jenin refugee camp searching for a particular "terrorist". The subsequent fighting was intense


The Electronic Intifada (EI), (http://electronicintifada.net/new.shtml)
found at electronicIntifada.net, publishes news, commentary, analysis, and reference materials about the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict from a Palestinian perspective

[invisibleplanet]

Originally posted by gunjack
http://www.templeofblood.com/~ncc386/ubb_images/guess_what.jpg

http://electronicintifada.net/v2images/nav/home/main.jpg (http://electronicintifada.net/new.shtml)

photo taken by musa al-shaer

[gunjack]

I.P. are you palestinian? you are always so anti-israel, have you ever been to either country? what gives you the right to take sides?
what you read in the media?

this is a complex situation in an enigmatic reigon, who are we to speculate?


the governmental USA is going to continue along its set path and the "terrorists" or "extremists" or whatever are going to go farther and farther, what the fuck do i have to do with it? or you for that matter? if the opportunity to help anyone, at anytime arises, i will take it, but i am not going to seek an active part in any conflict of national interests, because my interests and ideals have nothing to do with all of this nonsense.

[m j]

no future..................

[invisibleplanet]

Originally posted by gunjack
I.P. are you palestinian? you are always so anti-israel, have you ever been to either country? what gives you the right to take sides?
what you read in the media?

this is a complex situation in an enigmatic reigon, who are we to speculate?


the governmental USA is going to continue along its set path and the "terrorists" or "extremists" or whatever are going to go farther and farther, what the fuck do i have to do with it? or you for that matter? if the opportunity to help anyone, at anytime arises, i will take it, but i am not going to seek an active part in any conflict of national interests, because my interests and ideals have nothing to do with all of this nonsense.

one cannot ignore the timing of events....

and so the increase in pace against UN wishes on the part of the US Military has more to do with the forthcoming elections, than the current threat which IRAQ is perceived as holding.

²gunny - i did not consider your feelings at all before i posted this, or the university thread.

- my family has many religions and nations within it , including Islam and Judaism- and so it becomes difficult for me, to remain unaffected

[alex cortex]

http://warincontext.org/

Critical Perspectives on the War on Terrorism, War Against Iraq, and the Middle East Conflict

[grobelaar]

Originally posted by Sheridan
I myself dont condone war, but with threats coming from iraq and north korea, north korea poses the biggest threat. they truly are working on 'weapons of mass destruction'. a term I find so ironic. what kind of weapons does the usa have? weapons of minor destruction? just because we can put a computer chip in a bomb and have it 'hit its target' without any loss to civilian life (yeah right) doesn't make it any less lethal and wrong. destruction is destruction is destruction. it is death either way you look at it. and it is all wrong.

Israel, India and Pakistan all illegally acquired Nuclear capability and yet nothing was done to counter this - As a neighbour of Israel and given their human right, anti-islamic and record for invading other territory I too would want to have some weapons of mass of destruction to keep them in check.

Already Turkey is digging up old documents and treaties saying that they own some of the Iraqi oil fields - perhaps they have more confidence in the weapons inspectors appraisals and fancy their chances against an impoverished and disarmed Iraq - The vultures are circling already...

[DsD]

Originally posted by Sheridan
just because we can put a computer chip in a bomb and have it 'hit its target' without any loss to civilian life (yeah right) doesn't make it any less lethal and wrong.

haha fantastic joke!



ok and now some other things...
sadam can do what he wants... the war is planed... now we just can wait or protest against it.

israel don`t respect the human rights and fundamental freedoms. they are not better than a guy from austria that died 1945. (thats my oppinion so read it and hate me for that. i don`t care...)