why the U.K?

[[sik]]

ive been thinkin for a while, going over it in my head, why london(thinking of the bombings)? why not us(U.S.A)?
i just dont understand. is it closer? why not new york...L.A, chi-town? why th U.K?

[penciLneck]

Its Blair country.

[[sik]]

i just wonder if my government..(i fukin hate the basterds) r doing somthin right. somthin...
u all need to tighten that shit up...please

[Hagbard]

...we don't want to tighten up, maybe thats the point...

[Sheridan]

why not london?
a major metropolis.
world renown city.
it is the face of england.
a perfect way to slap her across the cheek.

why madrid?
why new york?
why DC?

[schlongfingers]

We need to stop blindly following your government in the future, and deal with the situation now occuring as a result of our previous actions. Which unfortunately means a loss of liberty for everybody here.

[fab]

Originally posted by [sik]
ive been thinkin for a while, going over it in my head, why london(thinking of the bombings)? why not us(U.S.A)?
i just dont understand. is it closer? why not new york...L.A, chi-town? why th U.K?

euhm...'cause they have already killed more than 1'000 american people, they have destroyed the twin towers, a symbol for all american residents and for people worldwide... and nothing happened in UK until these 2 bombings.

UK is a big part of the 'coalition' you remember?

then if your question was 'why terrorism is terrorism?' or some other kind of phylosophical question, i dont have the answer.

[[sik]]

when i was in london last winter, i saw some radical shit in newspaper. outside mosques, almost........well it was anti semetic, anti american.


i dont know.
religion is evil.

[Spandex]

@schlongfingers

I *really* don't think giving up some of our basic rights (or "traditional freedoms" as Blair would say) will help to "deal" with the situation. As everyone seems to be aware, we've angered the world even more than usual with our recent wars.. probably the best way to end the cycle of violence is to stop participating in it. The alternative is a never-ending series of arrests as we treat the symptoms rather than the cause.

edit: which may be what you meant.. it sounded like you thought the loss of liberty might be "necessary" tho?

[[sik]]

i wish my country was still run by this slave owner-
http://sc94.ameslab.gov/TOUR/tjefferson.html

[[sik]]

Originally posted by [sik]
i just wonder if my government..(i fukin hate the basterds) r doing somthin right. somthin...
u all need to tighten that shit up...please
i respect that.
good one.

[[sik]]

"edit: which may be what you meant.. it sounded like you thought the loss of liberty might be "necessary" tho?"
no way.
i just wonder why they havent attacked the u.s instead of the u.k.

[schlongfingers]

Originally posted by Spandex
@schlongfingers

I *really* don't think giving up some of our basic rights (or "traditional freedoms" as Blair would say) will help to "deal" with the situation. As everyone seems to be aware, we've angered the world even more than usual with our recent wars.. probably the best way to end the cycle of violence is to stop participating in it. The alternative is a never-ending series of arrests as we treat the symptoms rather than the cause.

edit: which may be what you meant.. it sounded like you thought the loss of liberty might be "necessary" tho?

I think at a basic level there are two choices facing the government, <b>A</b> pull out of Iraq altogether and apologise unreservedly or <b>B</b> introduce ID cards, and give the police the power (ie remove the threat of recriminations for perceived racism) to stop and search anyone at any time.

Much as I (and I think most people in the UK) like A and detest B, the latter is not going to happen. Public opinion on this subject does not influence this government, as evidenced by the inaction after the overwhelming public opposition to entering Iraq in the first place. Therefore, it's gonna get pretty nasty, I think it's inevitable.

[love_tempo]

Definitely inevitable, but not right. The police agree that they have enough power already. And if the police are happy with their powers that suggests to me that they have too much already.

Certainly they have much more power than they had during the IRA's terror campaign. And a significant minority of officers abused those lesser powers to victimise innocent Irish nationals throughout the troubles. Too many innocent Irish persons who resided in the UK in the 80's can report first-hand experiences of outright harrassment by police.

I don't envy Muslims residing in the UK at the moment. I already hear the thinly veiled racist slurs being mumbled around my office. If I was a Muslim living in the UK I would be seriously considering moving to Canada now.

[penciLneck]

I don't envy Muslims residing in the UK at the moment. I already hear the thinly veiled racist slurs being mumbled around my office. If I was a Muslim living in the UK I would be seriously considering moving to Canada now.

I totally agree, saying its right to shoot someone dead on sight because they look like a 'terrorist' is the beginning of the endgame. It shocks me to think that people on here think that is justifiable. No wonder the muslim community is so freaked out by this incident.

[stinkfinger]

its just you english lot. evryone loves the scottish, we ain't getting bombed (yet)

[thembuzz]

easy solution: if non-terrorist muslims just start carrying around their shit in briefcases instead of ruckacks, then we can easily identify the terrorists, et voila! no innocent, law-abiding citizens need to be shot

[stoof]

lol

[love_tempo]

:)

They could wear top hats too so the police could pick them off in a crowd.

[Sheridan]

Originally posted by love_tempo
:)

They could wear top hats too so the police could pick them off in a crowd.

I think they should wear soccer jerseys with their name and number on the back. then there's no need for guns. a nice solid slide tackle from behind should do the trick.

[Jeniffer Mills]

..Why Sharm el Sheik?

[JonnySpeed]

because London is far more multi-cultural and substantially less ghettoed than NYC. And when you bomb americans they cry like bitches for years on end, which is just a fucking pain in the arse - despite them funding the Irish to bomb us for 25 years

[JonnySpeed]

[love_tempo]

Originally posted by JonnySpeed
- despite them funding the Irish to bomb us for 25 years

very true, and so many of the american politicians involved in waging the war on terror were the same people giving and helping to lobby for this funding.

The IRA's real support was the funding from the US. They had a ready supply of cash from ignorant american business men. But as far as I remember there wasn't even one case of criminal action against these people?

And one of the factors that really escalated the conflict was indiscriminate internment. Whole families would be randomly interned in NI. Then they would be subject to torture.

A common torture tactic was taking people up in helicoptors and forcing them to confess. They would throw people out if they didn't. Of course, the victim was blindfolded so they didn't know how high up they were. This happened one of my uncle-in-laws and he has had serious mental health problems ever since the trauma.

And now the politicians want to introduce powers to detain terror suspects for upto 3-months. Doesn't this sound suspiciously like internment by another name? There's no better way to radicalise whole extended families than by interning and abusing innocent people.

Amnesty routinely reported that the RUC even had a fine collection of torture instruments. Why should we trust the mainland UK police not to abuse even more liberal powers now? Especially as there is clearly far more animosity toward 'Pakis' in the UK that there ever was against 'Paddys'.

[Spandex]

Originally posted by schlongfingers
Therefore, it's gonna get pretty nasty, I think it's inevitable.

Well it certainly will be with *that* attitude young man :)

Seriously.. it's not inevitable. The massive marches nearly stopped the Iraq war.. they caused Blair massive headaches. That's never happened BEFORE a war before. What do you think the protests would be like if he decided to attack Iran next? If public opinion in the US and UK hadn't been so strongly against Iraq they might already have done it.

As for ID cards.. there are at least 10,000 people who refuse to accept that turning our country into a racist police state is "inevitable":-

http://www.no2id.net/

[decadnids]

Originally posted by JonnySpeed

but then again if you beleave in one word of Islamic (or any religious) teaching then maybe you deserve people abusing you.


what a load of bollocks.

[V Knid esq]

I have said this before but it bears repeating. I have to deal with the NHS computer system on a day-to-day basis. People *want* that to work, it has an enormous store of good will, yet it is still consistently faulty. The i.d. card system will be much bigger, and people will be at best resentful and at worst deliberately fraudulent with it. Very simply - it WILL NOT WORK. It is an identity thief's dream. It's a fucking mess, it's a 'we must DO something' fudge, it's fucking rubbish.

There is no need for any extra legislation. In case you hadn't noticed, terrorism and murder are already illegal...

[V Knid esq]

I have said this before but it bears repeating. I have to deal with the NHS computer system on a day-to-day basis. People *want* that to work, it has an enormous store of good will, yet it is still consistently faulty. The i.d. card system will be much bigger, and people will be at best resentful and at worst deliberately fraudulent with it. Very simply - it WILL NOT WORK. It is an identity thief's dream. It's a fucking mess, it's a 'we must DO something' fudge, it's fucking rubbish.

There is no need for any extra legislation. In case you hadn't noticed, terrorism and murder are already illegal...

[V Knid esq]

I have said this before but it bears repeating. I have to deal with the NHS computer system on a day-to-day basis. People *want* that to work, it has an enormous store of good will, yet it is still consistently faulty. The i.d. card system will be much bigger, and people will be at best resentful and at worst deliberately fraudulent with it. Very simply - it WILL NOT WORK. It is an identity thief's dream. It's a fucking mess, it's a 'we must DO something' fudge, it's fucking rubbish.

There is no need for any extra legislation. In case you hadn't noticed, terrorism and murder are already illegal...

[V Knid esq]

I have said this before but it bears repeating. I have to deal with the NHS computer system on a day-to-day basis. People *want* that to work, it has an enormous store of good will, yet it is still consistently faulty. The i.d. card system will be much bigger, and people will be at best resentful and at worst deliberately fraudulent with it. Very simply - it WILL NOT WORK. It is an identity thief's dream. It's a fucking mess, it's a 'we must DO something' fudge, it's fucking rubbish.

There is no need for any extra legislation. In case you hadn't noticed, terrorism and murder are already illegal...

[JonnySpeed]

Originally posted by JonnySpeed

but then again if you beleave in one word of Islamic (or any religious) teaching then maybe you deserve people abusing you.

Originally posted by decadnids
what a load of bollocks

totally. that came across all wrong. poor humour. sorry nan.

[Tuttle]

why london?
why madrid?
why new york?
why DC?

YOU ARE AT WAR!
Everybody just talk about terrorist, thats ill...
Most of the countrys in the Arabian World had a pupped gouvernment installed by the US.
A democratic gouvernment disturbs economic policy of US. Its all about Da Oil, ya remember?
I don´t know why GB - ESP - POL go with US in this crusade.
This Countrys had a good propaganda machine, most of population believe in pictures like "we bring peace" "we hunt terrorist" or "we must protect ourself".
A lot of pressure is the reason for militant resistance. the arabs had a big culture in stop crusaders, because this is not the first one. If the western world change his world policy it is possible to stop this kind of resistance and make them all friends, i guess.

[Lady E]

Originally posted by Spandex



As for ID cards.. there are at least 10,000 people who refuse to accept that turning our country into a racist police state is "inevitable":-

http://www.no2id.net/

thank spandex- i have signed that now.

[Spandex]

Just had a giggle when I noticed Knid's post that appeared 4 times (presumably when the server was dying) starts "I have said this before but it bears repeating" :)

I signed that pledge a few weeks ago and forgot about it.. then got the mail through saying "we've reached our target" and suddenly realised I had to actually go thru with it.. I mailed some friends saying "please sign up as well" and discovered they were all already signed up... makes u feel all warm n fuzzy.

[Hagbard]

Yeah I signed up too, and for everyone who isn't in a position to refuse ID cards.. you can sign this one and support the law breakers!

"I will actively support those people who, on behalf of all of us,
refuse to register for an ID card and I pledge to pay at least £20 into
a fighting fund for them but only if 50,000 other people do the same."

http://www.pledgebank.com/resist

[phonudja]

now, as we're on a general "why?" question?

why are there people, British citizens who will accept the government the people put in power to not have to justify their actions when disaster results from it - and instead use that very American logic of "you know everyone who doesn't agree with us is born evil".
Is there a British tradition of doing this kind of thing, too?

I think before you even start to talk about a 'necessity' of handing in your natural freedom for a security this country promises you - you need to think about who put you in the situation first.

grrr grrr grrr